tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7649826198961930411.post2538587762260264794..comments2023-11-02T22:17:59.419+11:00Comments on Sydney Anglican Heretics: Episcopalian Bishop of South Sydney, Rob Forsyth, Found Loitering in the Shadow of Jean RousseauErichttp://www.blogger.com/profile/04827951993182450846noreply@blogger.comBlogger18125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7649826198961930411.post-54783307965401216172008-06-14T15:05:00.000+10:002008-06-14T15:05:00.000+10:00Yes, but we know that at least Cain & Able beleive...Yes, but we know that at least Cain & Able beleived there was a God who created all things and both offered sacrifices to God.<BR/><BR/>In the end Cain did not heed God's advice and descended into sin, even murdering his brother. Bad it is yet atheism is another thing.<BR/><BR/>Nevertheless, I recognise what I have pondered about raising children and instruction which resulted in atheism is a big call to take away a man's commission.<BR/><BR/>I'll leave it at that.<BR/><BR/>Neil Mooreneil moorehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04381046852732380906noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7649826198961930411.post-90574515984797522282008-06-14T12:36:00.000+10:002008-06-14T12:36:00.000+10:00It is suspicious, but to be fair, the NT criteria ...It is suspicious, but to be fair, the NT criteria for an elder include managing his *children* well, not necessarily his adult offspring. After all, Adam and Eve had the best raising possible, but still sinned.Ktisophiloshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16718156076583190052noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7649826198961930411.post-71849273707475709852008-06-13T19:22:00.000+10:002008-06-13T19:22:00.000+10:00Neil,I am no expert on these matters. In fact, I k...Neil,<BR/><BR/>I am no expert on these matters. In fact, I know nada about it. However, it would seem strange that an honourable and kindly man who, say, for the sake of argument, had his wife leave him for no fundamentally good reason (e.g. physical abuse or adultery), would have his appointment threatened because of this very sad and lonely event, yet a man who failed to raise his sons to know the love and wisdom of our heavenly Father is allowed to continue in his position.<BR/><BR/>Then again, as a new father myself I can only begin to sense the difficulties of this responsibility and fatherhood is not some algorithm of certainty. In others words, I know I'll cock up sooner or later.Johnhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17496161581317710863noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7649826198961930411.post-53033315679116592222008-06-12T23:45:00.000+10:002008-06-12T23:45:00.000+10:00I would like to receive comments negative or posit...I would like to receive comments negative or positive on my question of whether a man whose instruction to his sons or daughters has reared atheists has demerits in terms of leadership in the Church according to New Testament guidleines.<BR/><BR/>Neil Mooreneil moorehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04381046852732380906noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7649826198961930411.post-60831121890244644642008-06-12T13:29:00.000+10:002008-06-12T13:29:00.000+10:00Folks I have always had a problem with the idea th...Folks I have always had a problem with the idea that a providential wind blew, exposing the land for those chaps to stomp across. As I understand physics(my physics teacher would have said-not very well)said wind would have to continue blowing, until all had scurried across, right? I don't suppose even the most deluded propose it blew the water up to Transylvania so as to give them time to make the trip, right? So we have a very strong providential wind, one that dries absolutely sodden land and holds back megga litres of water, against gravity. But this same fierce wind didn't blow the scurriers away? What a miracle!<BR/><BR/>Those who propose this are like those who, contrary to Scripture and reason, deny that the flood of Noah was world-wide, as in covering the whole globe.<BR/><BR/>BTW CMI has recently released the latest version of The Answers Book which covers such issues as The Flood, Carbon 14 dating, races, skin, colours, and who did Cain marry etc, questions which are in many peoples minds. Available at www.creationontheweb.com In my experience those who bring up objections to Scripture have never read The Answers Book. Vital reading for any Christian.Warwickhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09787597131736985239noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7649826198961930411.post-58369804042056535792008-06-12T12:31:00.000+10:002008-06-12T12:31:00.000+10:00Thanks Sam.Thanks Sam.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7649826198961930411.post-941067379457745072008-06-12T01:17:00.000+10:002008-06-12T01:17:00.000+10:00Geoff, I didn't say this earlier because it was pa...Geoff, I didn't say this earlier because it was passed on to me by another person but I tend to trust that person's testimony.<BR/><BR/>If I am wrong I am happy to apologise to Rob Forsyth.<BR/><BR/>The story is as follows:<BR/><BR/>Several years ago, Evangelical Union was planning on bringing John Polkinghorne out to speak. There were EU members who were disturbed by this and went to Rob Forsyth to complain that John Polkinghorne does not believe in the Virgin Birth, to which Rob replied something along the lines of "Well, I have some problems with the Virgin Birth too."<BR/><BR/>Now I might be misquoting Rob here. It might have been a throwaway line. As I said, I am happy to be corrected by Rob and will apologise if I am in error.<BR/><BR/>If the statement, as relayed to me, is true it is consistent with an observable depreciation of miracles elsewhere by Rob.<BR/><BR/>Samsam druckerhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10410050665216630349noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7649826198961930411.post-69515037439142304402008-06-11T14:02:00.000+10:002008-06-11T14:02:00.000+10:00Geoff,Here is what Rob wrote on this blog:"One poi...Geoff,<BR/><BR/>Here is what Rob wrote on this blog:<BR/><BR/>"One point of clarification. I do not think Exodus 14.21 (thanks for the correction) is a miracle as such, but I do believe that the Lord did bring it about that the sea was turned into dry land, by providential use of so called 'natural' means."<BR/><BR/>Geoff, this is not what the passage says. Furthermore, would a bible-believing Jew subscribe to this "naturalising" up of the text?<BR/><BR/>Rob then goes onto to attempt to find an inconsistency in our reading of the Bible:<BR/> <BR/>"And now a question to John. I see you deny my hermeneutical principle about what God by his word is teaching us. What is yours? <BR/><BR/>An example will make my point. Do you believe that the Bible is teaching that there is a large body of water above the sky of heavens as is asserted by Genesis 1:6-8"<BR/><BR/>You work it out yourself, Geoff. We already have.Johnhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17496161581317710863noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7649826198961930411.post-3870498823202431672008-06-10T21:56:00.000+10:002008-06-10T21:56:00.000+10:00I had a read of his article. Concerning the red se...I had a read of his article. Concerning the red sea crossing. When Rob wrote; "The same can be said of other genuine miracles. By miracle here I am talking not about events in which the remarkable timing of a natural event has significance, like possibly the wind blowing back the Red Sea in Exodus 15."<BR/><BR/>My interpretation was he was saying that SOME might say it was natural phenomena with remarkable timing. So a conversation like this might go;<BR/><BR/>person a: See, miracles happen, the crossing of the red sea is an example<BR/><BR/>person b: Oh I can explain that, it's a natural phenomena, the blew it back and the timing was remarkable. <BR/><BR/>I think this is the case because he then goes on to say he is talking about miracles like the feeding of the five thousand, where no possible explanation can be given if it were to happen before your eyes other than accepting it as a miracle or a clever trick. <BR/><BR/>I know it doesn't disprove what you are saying Sam, as you believe is he is guilty of the same thing with how he views Genesis. But based on his article I wouldn't say he was denying that a miracle took place. But then again maybe his October 2006 thing was different altogether.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7649826198961930411.post-43974792118478301602008-06-10T21:23:00.000+10:002008-06-10T21:23:00.000+10:00If Bishop Forsyth has two atheist sons it brings t...If Bishop Forsyth has two atheist sons it brings to mind the NT instructions concerning the qualifications for leadership in the Church. Obviously something has gone wrong in the instructiuon given by Bishop Forsyth to his sons. <BR/><BR/>I wonder whether he has considered his position and come to a satisfied mind?<BR/><BR/>Neil Mooreneil moorehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04381046852732380906noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7649826198961930411.post-33403531885078545482008-06-10T19:06:00.000+10:002008-06-10T19:06:00.000+10:00"The same can be said of other genuine miracles. B..."The same can be said of other genuine miracles. By miracle here I am talking not about events in which the remarkable timing of a natural event has significance, like possibly the wind blowing back the Red Sea in Exodus 15."<BR/><BR/>Weird. i don't see how the crossing of the red sea can be seen as anything less than a miracle. Even if natural events like that occur, the timing and the biblical account seem to show it as something else. <BR/><BR/>I shall have a read!Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7649826198961930411.post-46550955964854831162008-06-10T00:51:00.000+10:002008-06-10T00:51:00.000+10:00For the information of Geoff, the article was on t...For the information of Geoff, the article was on the your.sydneyanglicans.net website under the title of Miracles, Intelligent Design and the limits of science.<BR/><BR/>I quote an extract "The same can be said of other genuine miracles. By miracle here I am talking not about events in which the remarkable timing of a natural event has significance, like possibly the wind blowing back the Red Sea in Exodus 15."<BR/><BR/>Samsam druckerhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10410050665216630349noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7649826198961930411.post-81840432507583267952008-06-09T12:32:00.000+10:002008-06-09T12:32:00.000+10:00Geoff,As I recall there was a thread on the Anglo ...Geoff,<BR/><BR/>As I recall there was a thread on the Anglo Forums discussing this and some have denied its historicity. It's rarely 'this' to the exclusion of 'that' but a continuum of disbelief.<BR/><BR/>If you go to the website for the pagan group ISCAST you should be able to find Rob's complete text.<BR/><BR/>As I stated, he watered down the clearly miraculous occurrence of the REd Sea's parting and made it more of a naturalistic event to do with fortuitous timing. If he had read the account he just couldn't be so dismissive of the miracle that occurred.Johnhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17496161581317710863noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7649826198961930411.post-66188009728705095072008-06-09T08:34:00.000+10:002008-06-09T08:34:00.000+10:00What did he say about the crossing of the red sea?...What did he say about the crossing of the red sea?I've heard evangelicals deny Gen 1-11, but never the events of the Exodus. <BR/><BR/>He wasn't denying the location was he? Saying it was probably "The sea of reeds" as opposed to the "red sea" was he?Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7649826198961930411.post-46062875965896180502008-06-08T23:38:00.000+10:002008-06-08T23:38:00.000+10:00Geoff,Yes, the proof is in a 2006 talk he gave at ...Geoff,<BR/><BR/>Yes, the proof is in a 2006 talk he gave at ISCAST, an organisation brimming with silly men who pretend to be Christian but it just seems much easier to believe they're not because of their fanciful and deluded ideas about Scripture and Jesus.<BR/><BR/>See my 24/2/07 blog piece called 'Gaia, or how I traded my Anglican heritage to a pagan goddess for 30 pieces of silver.' on some of Rob's "Christian" material.<BR/><BR/>BTW, rumour has it that Rob has two atheist sons. Having been once a heathen myself, I really don't blame the lads for not accepting the watered-down version of Christianity that their father spruiks as the genuine thing.Johnhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17496161581317710863noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7649826198961930411.post-16408926658780918222008-06-08T22:42:00.000+10:002008-06-08T22:42:00.000+10:00Well, I can vouch for Rob's general position. I wa...Well, I can vouch for Rob's general position. I was at a meeting with him many years ago, in his Barney's days; there he denied that Adam and Eve were real people, and inferred that the creation in Gen 1 was story time. He appeared a little hesitant about the flood, but kept his cards to his chest; as the group was busily kicking the dust over Adam and Eve and silly people who believed they existed (Paul springs to mind!).Critiashttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16237963162637891378noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7649826198961930411.post-31774316881345450622008-06-08T21:34:00.000+10:002008-06-08T21:34:00.000+10:00Hi SamWhat did Rob actually say? Is there anywhere...Hi Sam<BR/><BR/>What did Rob actually say? Is there anywhere we could find his skepticism over Israel's crossing of the Red Sea?<BR/><BR/>Cheers<BR/><BR/>GeoffAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-7649826198961930411.post-32536903900970825822008-06-08T20:27:00.000+10:002008-06-08T20:27:00.000+10:00Thanks Sam, similarly, Moore is on the same path, ...Thanks Sam, similarly, Moore is on the same path, I fear, as Princeton, for similar reasons. Princeton was once a bastion of conservative scholarship. It then compromised on Genesis 1 and is now, for that, and other reasons, I guess, but note the first apostasy: a well known liberal college. Should Moore go the same way, say bye bye to a strong diocese in a couple of generations (God forbid).Erichttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04827951993182450846noreply@blogger.com